How to be a Safe Place for People
with Bob Goff
Most people have one or two things they’re passionate about. They dedicate all their time and being to those few things, but not Bob. Bob Goff is one of the most passionate people you’ll ever meet. His passions span different fields, bringing into our lives the author, lawyer, educator, and adventurer we’ve come to know and admire.
He has been teaching a class at Pepperdine Law School for 15 years and teaches another class at San Quentin State Prison. Bob’s adventures have seen him travel with his sons from Mexico, all through Canada, to San Francisco in Harley Davidsons. He has also sailed to Hawaii and back with almost no sailing experience.
Bob jokes that he just came from the factory with a lot of energy and enthusiasm. He spoke to Jennie about living with a sense of anticipation and being a safe space for others.
Here’s Jennie and Bob’s edited conversation:
When you decide to take a risk, are you overcoming fears, or do you only see the potential to have fun?
Bob: I’m living with anticipation for what might be possible.
We have an all-knowing God, but the angels only know what He tells them. What if you were to picture the angels leaning over the rails of heaven, wondering what'll happen next?
I want to dazzle the angels, and that’s not achieved by doing risky stuff. It’s through obedience. But you can live with both of those intentions. You can live an obedient life and be obedient to this calling to fan the flames of the unique gift God has given you. That's the tension we're trying to navigate constantly.
In your book ‘Undistracted,’ you talk about not wanting to miss your life. Talk to the person who’s too scared to rock the boat. What would you say to someone who is risk-averse?
Bob: I would ask, what is that connected to? People who don’t know me well would see me as a hippie-skippy guy. But underneath that are several layers. When you get down to it, underneath all that is a super insecure guy who was afraid everybody would reject him.
Growing up, I felt lost because I thought I’d be left alone and rejected. And that does some weird stuff to you. You have to ask yourself, what are the stories you told yourself? What did you do to deal with the stories you told yourself?
That is the beauty of what Jesus has invited us to. You can take an honest look at the story you've told yourself and pour a ton of truth and obedience over that. Then something beautiful will happen.
You are a lawyer, which led to adventures with Uganda, governments, and bringing all these crazy people together. Can you talk about that?
Bob: It doesn’t get any more traditional than having a white picket fence around this little house we got and being a lawyer. I wore suits and tried cases, but there's something about this idea of being a new creation. So, I'm not letting my capabilities limit me.
Some of us are known for what we do.
If you take away everything you're known for, what remains is who you are.
And taking away all the capabilities you're known for is the adventure. Then, you have a conversation with God to show you the next version of yourself.
Keep current with who God is turning you into instead of focusing on who you were. God has already given us everything we need to lead beautiful, godly lives. I hope we can summon enough courage to say what we need in our faith communities.
I want you to constantly assess who God has dropped into your life and the opportunities He has brought forward. Then ask yourself, what's distracting you from them? What keeps you from being the person God has created you to be?
Did you always know what you were passionate about? Was it always clear, or did you stumble your way into it?
Bob: It's more of a stumble. Some people describe their interactions with God as a conversation. For me, it's more about knowing what the authoritative word of God said. I'm a Bible verse guy, but none of my books have Bible verses because I know what I'm supposed to do.
I want to talk to the guy at the tire store, and I want him to feel welcome. I'm not trying to be right. I know how to write a trial brief and win, but I'm not trying to be correct. I'm trying to be Jesus, who always made a simpler, more authentic, and accessible version of the message.
Has it been hard for you to stay so simple? What do you have to be careful of?
Bob: Simple is my resting position. I’m careful of people who are hypercritical of one another. I've wondered if, in somebody's zeal to make sure someone else is following what they should be doing, they somewhat lose their own way. And so, I haven't been influenced when somebody pointed a finger in my direction.
I'm not saying you should go light on either doctrine or mistakes that people made. But be a safe place. I want to be a safe place for people, which enables me to do worthwhile stuff. Although I have a lot of thoughts, I keep them in my thought bubble. That allows me to watch my tongue.
I’ve got a fast tongue, and I don't want to be the guy who condemns others. I want to be someone safe, where we can continue the adventure and conversation to discover what God has to say about whatever we’re discussing.
The first time I heard about you was in a Don Miller book. Let’s go back to the day when Don Miller ended up on your dock.
Bob: Don and a couple of guys were paddling their kayaks up while I was down by the docks. I asked if they were hungry. Don and the guys paddled up, and we ended up becoming friends. I didn't know he wrote books. I had never heard of the guy before. When they paddled away at midnight, we all jumped in the water. That’s a tradition we have when anybody leaves. We jump off the dock and celebrate.
Such traditions create a moment you can return to when you feel lost.
And we need to do more of that intentionally. I want to do more of that with people. So, it's looking for the opportunity and going for it.
We get about 27,383 days on Earth. That sounds like a high number until you have 23,000 days in the rearview mirror. You realize how fast that went by. So, I ask myself, what do I want to leave behind? Someday I'm going to end up in a jar, and I want to leave behind proof that I was actually here. My writing is evidence that I had experiences and thoughts to share.
Many of us like to take risks, but something keeps us from doing it more often. So, it's easier to go through the mundane rather than to think outside the box. But you've probably felt that way and moved through it. Why is it still worth it?
Bob: The book of Romans tells us that suffering produces endurance. Endurance results in character, and character produces hope. People who are hopeful and happy have often experienced suffering and endurance. Their character manifests as hope, but we want to go straight to hope.
You must realize that you’re going through a hard time, then bring it to Jesus. Making your requests known to God starts with making the request known to yourself. Figure out what you need and assess what's around you. Assess what God is uniquely doing and plans to do in your life. Lift your eyes towards that.
Identify what you want to experience and hang a target on it. Hang targets on the things that are worth walking towards. Otherwise, you end up just doing some version of a tight circle. So, part of it is knowing what will outlast me and aiming for that. However, I'm not going to become a caricature.
If we start reading those news clippings, then we become caricatures. If I'm not in touch with the things I’m sad or concerned about, then I’m a caricature. This doesn’t mean I should be overwhelmed by those things, but I must be aware. That's what I want to advocate for. Let's figure out what the stories we tell ourselves are connected to.
Let's identify the myth and find out the truth about that. Let's also focus on what God has given us right now. Get real about the things you're sad about and those you're hopeful about. Find a couple of voices you can trust in your life.
You keep dreaming new dreams. What new dreams do you have today?
Bob: We started a school for girls in Afghanistan about six years ago. I didn't know anything about Afghanistan, besides their exclusion of girls from school. So, I flew to Kabul to meet a guy I had only spoken to via WhatsApp. I later found out he was in a leadership position, and he wanted to know if I would trust him enough to do what he told me to do. He trusted me enough to build a school with me.
We've got a school in a province that doesn’t allow girls to go to school, but all our girls are in school because we asked. Despite the corrupt leadership, our request was honored because we were humble and respectful. They said our girls could keep going to school so long as we don't make a big deal about it.
It sounds noble to do something across the ocean, but there are only two times when somebody went across the ocean in Scripture. But Paul got shipwrecked, and Jonah got eaten. So, I want us to go across the street.
Love your neighbor.
Love God and love the people around you.
It is always a joy when Bob joins us on the podcast. We respect him so greatly, and his books are always remarkable reads. His most recent one is called ‘Undistracted: Capture Your Purpose. Rediscover Your Joy,’ and you can find it right here.
